Aerosoft Aerosoft Team [Inactive Account] 51558 Posted January 14, 2009 Aerosoft Share Posted January 14, 2009 As I think that Manhattan X will be one of the most complex scenery covering a medium large area (Manhattan is a lot larger then you think, a helicopter tour around half of the island takes 20 minutes), we done some serious framerate testing. Now take care this is done on my machines, some out there will be faster or slower even if they got the same hardware. The settings used are like this: Lens Bloom is off, all traffic at 35%, weather set at Ultra high. You will agree, all pretty high. Now I got two machines, let me tell you what they are and how Manhattan does on each of them. None of the machines are overclocked, no tweaks to fsx.cfg etc. Real standard stuff. While doing the test I got 6 browser tabs open, PhotoShop is loaded with a big Manhattan image, Outlook and MS word are also loaded. I am listening to a radio stream with nasty news from the Gaza area. As you see I don't believe in closing applications before starting FS, I have yet to see it make any difference. Note how Core I7 window is about 25% bigger, should put a bit more load on the CPU/GPU but not too much. Duo2Core, cheapest version, 2 gb of ram and a $55 graphics card (don't even know which one), FSX SP2 with DX9 on Windows XP Using the setting above I get this: Framerates are not very stable, there are drops to 9 every 20 seconds or so fps but on average is remains above 20 fps with ease. Very acceptable. Core I7, cheapest version, 3 Gb of ram, NVidia 8800 GTS, FSX SP2 on DX10 on Windows Vista Using the same settings I get this: Framerates are rock steady and I hardly see any drop below 30 fps. The Core i7 really does not show it's value in screenshots or FPS, but they over all 'feel' of the i7 machine is soo much smoother that there is no comparison. Now an experiment, how will the Core I7 machine do with all sliders to the right and all options activated? So all traffic at 100%. Bloom on etc. Interesting result, certainly as framerates are lower but still stable (and certainly acceptable): Overall, just as I expected, FSX does fine on both machines, nothing special there, but Manhattan X is very nicely optimized for sure.I am not going to show you the results of the scenery on Windows 7 because that would mean showing a beta (Manhattan X) on a beta OS (Windows 7). But let me say that I was rather happy and decided to move at least one of my other main machines to Windows 7. I already moved my net top to that great little (yes it IS rather small) OS. 2009 will be a great year for computers. We got brand new CPU's that are cheap and fast and we got a new OS that fits it perfectly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aerosoft Aerosoft Team [Inactive Account] 51558 Posted January 14, 2009 Author Aerosoft Share Posted January 14, 2009 One more... now at dusk so you see the car traffic a lot better. I did not count them but I think you see at least 500 moving cars in this shot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
macroth72 38 Posted January 14, 2009 Share Posted January 14, 2009 Hey Mathijs, really nice shots and good to hear about the frames...Ok, i know this is a little off topic of this thread but I like to ask you just for a small statement regarding Windows 7. I opened another thread in the general forum regarding this. Can you also get much better frames in Windows 7 compared to Vista? I'm not so sure about my frames there, they seem to good for a beta OS...Anyway Manhattan will be a sure buy. Let's get the cities alive. Now we have 3 fantastic looking of these (hong Kong, london and now Manhattan...). Maybe we get Frankfurt soon ? OK, I know it isn't such spectacular but it's right in the neighbourhood... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesChams 108 Posted January 15, 2009 Share Posted January 15, 2009 Really Nice, Mr. Kok! Is it expect to be released this month? Why do I ask? - I was just given another gift by you and Mr. Fletcher - winning another competition. I, frankly, evaluated 10 things on my Bulk order List #2 and after two days thinking about it - I'm still having a hard time deciding, which of your porducts to choose from. Perhaps, the release of this would make that decision harder. But, I've made up my mind to choose my gift prize by this weekend, after I return from work. Thank you for making me a happy Simmer. PS: Thanks to Aerosoft, I just upgraded my (x4) 150GB 10,000RPM Raptor HDD's [RAID 0] to (x4) 300GB 10,000RPM Raptor HDD's [RAID 0] just to find the space for all their addon's - I don't mind though; I'm getting the next - i7 Core - SkullTrail to run it on too. "Why?" , when I've got a really awesome system already? - Well, most pilots retire and build a plane or two to fly around in; because its either that, being a Cheif-CFI or, no flying. I found that I could do the same with the PC and be happier; without getting too broke, divorced, or de-licensed by the FAA - when I get too old or if I accidently do something foolish. But the real reason, is God loves me and has blessed me with all of these because I honor him with everthing He has given me. That is how I am blessed with everything you see me get; That is my legacy to all of you. Let the Wise heed my words and Honor their maker... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FSXaddict 18 Posted January 15, 2009 Share Posted January 15, 2009 About 500 more cars per block, a little smog overcast, and some good pizza, and I'll feel like I'm there... can't wait. Looks great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aerosoft Aerosoft Team [Inactive Account] 51558 Posted January 15, 2009 Author Aerosoft Share Posted January 15, 2009 Hey Mathijs, really nice shots and good to hear about the frames...Ok, i know this is a little off topic of this thread but I like to ask you just for a small statement regarding Windows 7. I opened another thread in the general forum regarding this. Can you also get much better frames in Windows 7 compared to Vista? I'm not so sure about my frames there, they seem to good for a beta OS...Anyway Manhattan will be a sure buy. Let's get the cities alive. Now we have 3 fantastic looking of these (hong Kong, london and now Manhattan...). Maybe we get Frankfurt soon ? OK, I know it isn't such spectacular but it's right in the neighbourhood...Like I said, Windows 7 is beta so it is hard to say for sure. But the last beta (the real public one) makes FSX run for sure faster on my core i7 machine. It does not seen to like FS2004 much though, but backward compatibility with these older applications is always one of the last things to optimize. I liked Vista (never fully understood what people had against it) but I love this Windows 7 beta. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aerosoft Aerosoft Team [Inactive Account] 51558 Posted January 15, 2009 Author Aerosoft Share Posted January 15, 2009 Really Nice, Mr. Kok! Is it expect to be released this month? Next Friday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FSXaddict 18 Posted January 15, 2009 Share Posted January 15, 2009 Mr. Kok,I'm very curious to this I7 and have been looking at exactly what you tested the Manhattan X scenery on, the cheapest version (2.66ghz). I see the difference it makes, but I am still wondering what difference it would make if you were to use the software that comes with it to "instantly" overclock it. How easy is it really, if you've tried, and what performance did it do? Thanks,Matt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aerosoft Aerosoft Team [Inactive Account] 51558 Posted January 16, 2009 Author Aerosoft Share Posted January 16, 2009 Mr. Kok,I'm very curious to this I7 and have been looking at exactly what you tested the Manhattan X scenery on, the cheapest version (2.66ghz). I see the difference it makes, but I am still wondering what difference it would make if you were to use the software that comes with it to "instantly" overclock it. How easy is it really, if you've tried, and what performance did it do? Thanks,MattWell overclocking the CPU (extremely easy with this one) showed an almost linear relation to FPS as was to expected. I can run the 4 cores (8 cores the OS of course) at 3400 Ghz without any voltage adaptation etc. More should be possible but to be honest I see little need for it now. The only critical thing is that the CPU starts to eat a LOT more electricity when you overclock it so you really need to think about 700 watt PSU's if this is what you want. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest M31 Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 Mathijs, Its probably too late now, but a helicopter tour mission for this scenery would have been nice, perhaps including one of the actual routes that the operators use there, this would highlight points of interest that might other wise not get noticed.Also, can imagine after that successful no engine and no loss of life ditching of an Airbus in the Hudson river yesterday that quite a few of us might want to try that!Cheers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aerosoft Aerosoft Team [Inactive Account] 51558 Posted January 16, 2009 Author Aerosoft Share Posted January 16, 2009 Mathijs, Its probably too late now, but a helicopter tour mission for this scenery would have been nice, perhaps including one of the actual routes that the operators use there, this would highlight points of interest that might other wise not get noticed.Also, can imagine after that successful no engine and no loss of life ditching of an Airbus in the Hudson river yesterday that quite a few of us might want to try that!Cheers.It's late but in fact we already made that mission! It's one of the tours of New York Helicopter Tours from Wall Street heliport. And does the whole south of Manhattan, Statue etc and then crosses over Central Park to East river. Includes full sound of the pilot with some tour guide stuff as well.And although the ditching yesterday was a amazing feat of flying, we got a policy of not making missions/adventures around actual accidents. It all ended well (amazingly well) but could have just as well ended with a serious loss of life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Glover 7 Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 I was going to comment on that A320 mishap, Mathijs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest M31 Posted January 16, 2009 Share Posted January 16, 2009 It's late but in fact we already made that mission! It's one of the tours of New York Helicopter Tours from Wall Street heliport. And does the whole south of Manhattan, Statue etc and then crosses over Central Park to East river. Includes full sound of the pilot with some tour guide stuff as well.Thanks, looking forward to this scenery, loved it in FS2004 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Airbusfreak 8 Posted January 17, 2009 Share Posted January 17, 2009 unbelievable... can we expect the same frame rates with the new products like mega airport munich and the german airports? would be very nice...aerosoft, you did a very nice job Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aerosoft Aerosoft Team [Inactive Account] 51558 Posted January 17, 2009 Author Aerosoft Share Posted January 17, 2009 unbelievable... can we expect the same frame rates with the new products like mega airport munich and the german airports? would be very nice...aerosoft, you did a very nice job Airports are not as easy to get this fast because of the overlaying ground stuff. I do believe that there will be progress this year as our development teams are getting far more professional. Doing things professionally really makes a difference in FSX, while it did not do so in FS2004 that was more forgiving in many ways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aerosoft Aerosoft Team [Inactive Account] 51558 Posted January 17, 2009 Author Aerosoft Share Posted January 17, 2009 Mathjis, thank you for not doing that about the ditching yesterday, because it also could be that the pilot could have shut down the right engine on his own, seeing as right now people didn't hear a loud boom from the right engine, just it swirling down... I also know someone that was on the flight...Seems to be birds sucked into both engines by now. One of the few reasons a modern aircraft can loose both engines.But as said, we never do accident recreation in missions. At least not for commercial stuff as we do this kind of things for professional projects. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FSXaddict 18 Posted January 18, 2009 Share Posted January 18, 2009 Well overclocking the CPU (extremely easy with this one) showed an almost linear relation to FPS as was to expected. I can run the 4 cores (8 cores the OS of course) at 3400 Ghz without any voltage adaptation etc. More should be possible but to be honest I see little need for it now. The only critical thing is that the CPU starts to eat a LOT more electricity when you overclock it so you really need to think about 700 watt PSU's if this is what you want.Thanks for the reply. Did you see a significant rise in frame rates once you overclocked the cpu to 3.4 versus 2.66, and how big of a jump was it? Thanks again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aerosoft Aerosoft Team [Inactive Account] 51558 Posted January 18, 2009 Author Aerosoft Share Posted January 18, 2009 Thanks for the reply. Did you see a significant rise in frame rates once you overclocked the cpu to 3.4 versus 2.66, and how big of a jump was it? Thanks again.I would say 20%. Another clear sign that it's the CPU that counts. The GPU hardly has anything serious to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest M31 Posted January 18, 2009 Share Posted January 18, 2009 I would say 20%. Another clear sign that it's the CPU that counts. The GPU hardly has anything serious to do.Until the next version of FS, of course:)I'd like to think MS will finally take note of current hardware trends, multi core (not just tack it on later) Crossfire/SLI do give benefits sometimes, especially at the larger screen resolutions, but so far, MS have ignored the advances made in the work that a modern GPU can do for them and they have ignored advances in other areas of PC development that really should have been built into FSX.I'm hoping they take note this time around.For now, I'm very happy, have a C2D E8400 @ 4GHz, 150 Raptors in RAID 0, 4GB dual channel, highly tuned system and OS, ETC ... and my performance in FSX almost totally maxed is very acceptable to me ... no single screenshot can do justice, but I get from 20 to 80 FPS when I check it, and that's good enough for now. I'm very confident I'll be able to run Manhattan X with fluid frame rates once its released.I did inquire about going to I7 on another PC enthusiast board, but the overwhelming advice was, that my rig performs very satisfactorily for what I do (FSX, and it does) and I should wait for the next generation of hardware and also the next version of FS and see what it demands ... chances are, its demands will kill the I7 stone dead like FSX did upon release to the hardware available. Of course, if you have an older spec PC that is struggling with FSX, then I7 might be a good idea, but I still maintain, the best of the best from Intel's C2D dual and quad core CPU's are more than adequate in a finely tuned OS and FSX install and cheaper too.I guess after about 20 years of PC building and trying to stay at the cutting edge ... I'm finally learning to stay one step behind and wait and see whats actually needed hardware wise. I'm not scrimping, just making that cash that might have went to a latest (soon to be outdated) I7 system, to other FS hardware, looking at a track IR amongst other stuff now.Cheers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aerosoft Aerosoft Team [Inactive Account] 51558 Posted January 22, 2009 Author Aerosoft Share Posted January 22, 2009 Until the next version of FS, of course:)I'd like to think MS will finally take note of current hardware trends, multi core (not just tack it on later) Crossfire/SLI do give benefits sometimes, especially at the larger screen resolutions, but so far, MS have ignored the advances made in the work that a modern GPU can do for them and they have ignored advances in other areas of PC development that really should have been built into FSX.Cheers.I have discussed this with some of the developers of FSX and they explained that there is not a lot more that can be send to the GPU. If you got a moderately good GPU you get reflections and bumps almost for free (so without a FPS penalty). But the rest of the world got to be calculated and popuated with objects, nothing a GPU can do. When the enviroment is limited as in most shooters you can do a lot more.Now what IS interesting is that there is a growing trend towards offloading some of the physics calculation to the GPU, that could really help as GPU's are so incredibly powerful these days. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest M31 Posted January 22, 2009 Share Posted January 22, 2009 I have discussed this with some of the developers of FSX and they explained that there is not a lot more that can be send to the GPU. If you got a moderately good GPU you get reflections and bumps almost for free (so without a FPS penalty). But the rest of the world got to be calculated and popuated with objects, nothing a GPU can do. When the enviroment is limited as in most shooters you can do a lot more.Now what IS interesting is that there is a growing trend towards offloading some of the physics calculation to the GPU, that could really help as GPU's are so incredibly powerful these days.Agreed. Lets hope those that are working on FS11 do make good use of all the different areas in current and maybe projected PC Hardware, they certainly never in FSX development.We have what we have, though, and it could have been a lot worse, like FS9, the after market folk like Aerosoft really make FSX shine.Cheers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phenocom 3 Posted January 25, 2009 Share Posted January 25, 2009 Hey Mathijs, really nice shots and good to hear about the frames...Ok, i know this is a little off topic of this thread but I like to ask you just for a small statement regarding Windows 7. I opened another thread in the general forum regarding this. Can you also get much better frames in Windows 7 compared to Vista? I'm not so sure about my frames there, they seem to good for a beta OS...Anyway Manhattan will be a sure buy. Let's get the cities alive. Now we have 3 fantastic looking of these (hong Kong, london and now Manhattan...). Maybe we get Frankfurt soon ? OK, I know it isn't such spectacular but it's right in the neighbourhood...Hi Macroth:You're forgetting RomeX by Cloud 9 and also Paris by VFR France and Cannes and Nice by VFR France also and dont forget VeniceX by Aerosoft ( which by the way I have and its fantastic!) Last but not least Aerosoft has Monico which is a country but is small enough to be a city. Also Aerosoft is planning a future release of VFR ParisX Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jim-wilson 0 Posted June 24, 2010 Share Posted June 24, 2010 As far as installation goes, my experience with Aerosoft has always been a good one and Manhattan X was no different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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